1. Come on then lets get a list of names down for who's got this so we can start partying up and get some private matched going. http://www.vgforums.co.uk/threads/cod-ww2-ps4-role-call.10312/
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Guest
New!! Join User Group option added. Head over the this thread to see more information and instructions on how to join - http://www.vgforums.co.uk/community/threads/join-user-group-mod.6449/

Xbox One X

Discussion in 'XBOX One' started by ODB, Jun 14, 2016.

  1. http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-xbox-one-project-scorpio-spec-analysis





    "Removing barriers... Innovation and the latest technology... delivering the world's most powerful console is something we absolutely want to do... the most powerful graphics processor that's been put into a game console... the highest res... the best frame-rate... no compromises... we can render at 60Hz... we can render fully uncompressed quality pixels... the best quality pixels... true 4K gaming..."

    The pitch presented at the E3 press conference for Project Scorpio is plain and simple. While some of the claims sound a little bizarre or straight-out laughable (uncompressed pixels?), Microsoft aims to regain control of the technological high ground with its own mid-generation console refresh. What we're looking at here is an ambitious leap-frogging of the PlayStation 4K Neo in technological terms, with Microsoft utilising the top-tier parts available from hardware partner AMD - technology we've yet to see fully revealed in the PC space.

    Actual performance figures and hard specs are thin on the ground, but there's enough information here for us to put together a picture on what Scorpio offers and whether it can indeed deliver on the claims made for it.


    PS4 PS4K Neo Xbox One Project Scorpio
    CPU
    Eight Jaguar cores clocked at 1.6GHz Eight Jaguar cores clocked at 2.1GHz Eight Jaguar cores clocked at 1.75GHz Eight cores, speculation: up-clocked Jaguar or equivalent
    GPU 18 Radeon GCN compute units at 800MHz 36 improved GCN compute units at 911MHz 12 GCN compute units at 853MHz Speculation: 56/60 GCN compute units at 800-850MHz
    Memory 8GB GDDR5 at 176GB/s 8GB GDDR5 at 218GB/s 8GB DDR3 at 68GB/s and 32MB ESRAM at max 218GB/s Over 320GB/s bandwidth - speculation: 12GB of GDDR5

    GPU: Much faster than PlayStation Neo
    First up, let's discuss the GPU - the area of the spec that Microsoft is clearly most proud of. The rumoured six TFLOPs of processing power is confirmed, out-stripping the 4.2TF found in PlayStation Neo by quite some margin. It's around 40 per cent faster, calling to mind the advantage PS4 had over Xbox One.

    We know how Sony has achieved its performance target - it is almost certainly utilising the AMD Polaris 10 graphics core, using 36 next-gen GCN compute units clocked at 911MHz. Essentially, it is a downclocked version of the Radeon RX 480 graphics card - AMD's upcoming $199 next-gen GPU, aimed squarely at the mainstream gamer while also offering good, entry-level VR capabilities. We can be fairly sure that this GPU is a cut-down version of a yet-to-be-seen product, quite possibly one with 40 compute units. By leaving a portion of the CUs deactivated, imperfect chips can be used from the production line - it's a tactic used on both PS4 and Xbox One, both of which have two offline CUs on the silicon.

    However, based on the differential in spec between Neo and Scorpio, it's unlikely that the new Microsoft console uses Polaris at all. A 40 CU part would need a mighty overclock to hit 6TF, and based on the rendered imagery we've seen, the heating assembly planned for Scorpio looks a little lacklustre. With that in mind, our money is on a downclocked version of AMD's upcoming Vega technology.

    Thanks to an AMD engineer rather unwisely posting a partial spec for Vega on his LinkedIn profile (!) we know that the fully enabled processor features 64 compute units. Assuming that this is cut down to 56 CUs (as in the Radeon R9 Fury, a pared back version of the 64 CU Fury X), a clock speed in the 830-850MHz region looks likely. Alternatively, and perhaps more likely, we could be seeing 60 CUs at 800MHz. Both represent a substantial increase over PlayStation 4K Neo, while the raw increase to performance over PS4 and Xbox One is obviously much larger.

    [​IMG]


    Memory: 12GB of GDDR5?
    Microsoft also dropped some hard figures in terms of memory bandwidth too, telling us that Scorpio has over 320GB/s of throughput. This gives us a couple of useful data points. Firstly, it's almost certainly the case that the ESRAM experiment on Xbox One is now a thing of the past - Microsoft will be following the approach pioneered by Sony in using a single, unified pool of memory based on PC graphics RAM technology. Which technology that is remains to be seen - will it be GDDR5 or the faster G5X found in Nvidia's GTX 1080?

    The stated figure of 320GB/s can be achieved with 8GB of G5X using a 256-bit bus, or alternatively it could be using a 384-bit interface paired with 12GB of GDDR5. Now, this is where the stylised renderings of the Scorpio motherboard prove rather useful as we can count the amount of memory modules on the board - 12 memory chips are visible, confirming the use of current-gen memory tech and not the HBM2 we expect to see on Vega and Nvidia's next-gen Titan. This also seems to suggest that Scorpio has another big advantage over PlayStation 4K Neo - not just over 100GB/s more bandwidth, but also an additional 4GB of onboard RAM.

    And this is a good thing for Microsoft in reaching its stated aim of handing in a worthy 4K experience - PlayStation Neo only offers up an additional 512MB of RAM for developers compared to the original PS4, meaning only limited space for higher resolution textures. Scorpio won't just deliver higher resolutions, but there'll be more space for higher detail textures. The only question will be on how quickly that RAM can be filled up - assuming that 5400rpm hard drives are still being used, 12GB will take a long time to fully occupy. On the flipside, we have heard from some developers that the 8GB of memory found in PlayStation Neo isn't quite enough to get the most out of 4K displays.



    [​IMG]

    CPU: Eight cores, but what are they?
    Microsoft didn't spend much time talking about the CPU technology found in Scorpio and if we were to be cynical about it, we'd suggest that it's because it's not going to show that much improvement over Xbox One. Just one specification was revealed - that Scorpio would have eight CPU cores, which brings it into line with the existing Xbox One, PS4 and indeed PS4K Neo.

    There are two theoretical CPU technologies available to Microsoft here - the existing Jaguar cores (or perhaps a more modern version thereof), or AMD's upcoming Zen technology. Weighing the balance of probabilities, we'd say that it's unlikely to be Zen - if it were, we'd expect Microsoft to have made a much bigger deal of it. But secondly, what we know of the eight-core Zen is that it's a high-end desktop processor that's likely to require a large area of silicon. Integrating that alongside an already large GPU core seems overly ambitious.

    With that in mind, we expect the disparity between CPU power and GPU in the consoles to grow even wider, and the importance of DX12 and GPGPU grows even more important - more tasks traditionally associated with the CPU will be hived off to the graphics hardware instead. Assuming Scorpio is indeed still using AMD's more mobile-orientated CPU cores, we should at least expect higher clock-speeds there - PlayStation Neo runs its cores at 2.1GHz vs the 'stock' 1.6GHz found on PS4.

    [​IMG]

    Can Project Scorpio deliver the VR and 4K promises?
    Based on existing AMD Radeon technology, the bottom line is that 6TF of GPU power isn't enough to power a convincing 4K experience. AMD's R9 390X offers around 5.9TF and struggles to push 4K resolution at anything like 30fps on modern PC titles. Now, we can assume that the move to the next-gen GCN architecture will give us some efficiency improvements, but it's hard to believe that this is enough to turn a 390X-level GPU into a top-tier Radeon R9 Fury X equivalent (8.4TF).

    But it has to be said that we have seen developers start to extract more from Xbox One and PS4 than we see on equivalent PC parts - something borne out from the E3 demos of Gears of War 4 and Forza Horizon 3, which are - remarkably - running on hardware equivalent to AMD's £80 R7 360 graphics card. So maybe - maybe we will indeed see 4K native titles.

    However, upscaling is equally as likely, and while it's not the true 4K we've been promised, this can produce some great results. For example, using Fury X on PC, we could run Star Wars Battlefront at 4K output but with an 85 per cent resolution scale. On top of that, we could increase quality settings over the console equivalents - and the end result looked phenomenal. We've also seen superb results from a straight 3200x1800 upscaled to 4K too. In terms of VR - that should be no problem. A 6TF Radeon GPU comfortably outperforms the baseline R9 290 and GTX 970 suggested for VR ready PCs.





    Where does this leave PlayStation 4K Neo?
    It's a remarkable turnabout. A good portion of PlayStation 4's success has been down to its spec advantage over Xbox One, combined with a focus on the hardcore player. Sony's technological advantage will be gone with the next wave of hardware - we already know that it cannot support true 4K resolution on cutting-edge games, because we've seen the internal documents that outline Sony's upscaling strategies for 4K display support (more on that soon). It's also unfeasible for Sony to produce a radically revised Neo - the silicon has been designed, developer kits have gone out. Matching Scorpio would require scrapping Neo's existing processor completely.

    Just about the only option available to Sony is the route Microsoft chose for Xbox One in the face of PS4's higher specification - overclocking the processor. It could inch the Neo a little closer to the target Scorpio spec, but hitting 6TF there is off the table: Sony would need a 40 CU Polaris 10 clocked at 1.2GHz to hit the same level. And that wouldn't address the 100GB/s bandwidth deficit or the 4GB memory gap we suspect will separate Neo and Scorpio.

    But there is an elephant in the room here: price. Microsoft's brief to AMD in producing this behemoth of a semi-custom design looks pretty obvious - to create the most powerful console possible. The GPU is more powerful and it's going to be larger, which means it's going to be more expensive to produce. Meanwhile, assuming we're right about the 4GB of additional memory, that's not going to be cheap either - when we attended AMD's Munich launch event for Fury X and the Radeon 300 series, we were told that adding an additional 4GB of GDDR5 to the R9 390/390X cost around them around $30 per unit. In short, we would not be surprised to see Scorpio cost significantly more than Neo - maybe even $100 more.

    But there's certainly going to be pressure on Sony here - particularly as its next console is targeted at the hardcore player, who wants the very best. If Neo launches this year, it'll have a healthy headstart over Scorpio. However, if we're looking at a March 2017 launch, many may consider until Scorpio appears - especially as the new hardware stands to deliver a tangibly more impressive technological upgrade over the established PlayStation 4.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. [​IMG]

    The world's most powerful console.

    The most powerful console ever, featuring 6 Teraflops of graphical processing power, true 4K gaming, and compatibility with Xbox One games and accessories.

    [​IMG]
    1. Scorpio Engine
    With 6 Teraflops, 326GB/s of Memory Bandwidth and advanced, custom silicon, the Scorpio Engine is the most powerful console gaming processor ever created.


    2. Vapour Chamber
    A first for home consoles, Project Scorpio’s Vapour Chamber uses advanced liquid cooling to ensure the Scorpio Engine stays cool.

    3. Centrifugal Fan
    A supercharger-style Centrifugal Fan rapidly pulls in and compresses air to deliver maximum cooling with minimum noise.


    4. Hovis Method
    To maximise performance and minimise power consumption, Project Scorpio uses the Hovis Method, a cutting edge digital power delivery system that custom tunes each console’s voltage.

    True

    4K
    Gaming

    6
    Teraflop
    GPU

    2.3
    GHz
    Custom CPU

    1TB

    HDD Storage

    12

    GB GDDR5
    Memory

    326
    GB/s
    Memory
    Bandwidth

    HDR
    Games &
    Entertainment

    4K
    UHD
    Blu-ray/DVD

     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  3. No one got one of these yet? I expected there to be some discussions/reviews up about it by now.
     
  4. I've read quite a few news reports and blog posts about it.

    Power is there to bring old and new games to a different level, but the actual exclusive games content is a down point.

    I'm seeing nothing different to the playstation pro apart from higher spec under the hood and giving games even more shine, it's good they both have the option available now.

    The main thing I'm seeing is microsoft isn't selling it as a new core unit, it's been released for gamers who want more from their hardware, this in turn gives hype to buy a lesser impact.

    For a second console I'm more pushed for a nintendo switch than xbox one s/x, and this is on one deciding factor, how awesome super mario odyssey looks :cool:
     
  5. Saw a review of Origins on it yesterday. Apparently looks great on PC, Pro and X. The review pretty much stated how great it looked on all 3 and despite clear differences they commended how well Ubi had done to make it look so close on all of them

    Got me thinking though. Those differences should by rights be massive Pro being worst, PC being best and X being in the middle. But the testing numbers made it clear to me that the issue is the games on X will only look as good as:

    A) the tech can allow
    B) on how much effort the devs have put in

    So it seems clear what they've done is made it for the pro, pushed just that little bit more for the X and done the usual on the PC where it looks better than anything else but still isn't great and Ubi have a history of not really trying much with PC
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  6. Xbone x vs PS4 Pro (my thoughts)

    I got the X Scorpio addition on release day and so far I'm impressed, the first game I played was Assassins Creed. When it first loaded up it was without the 4K patch as it need to be downloaded. (so it was accentually the standard Xbox version played on the x). It was pretty and ran well, after ten or fifteen minutes a message popped up on the screen asking if I would like to play in 4K. accepting the message made the game look completely gorgeous. (not that it looked to shabby before) the game still ran perfectly with the higher resolution.

    Next I bought COD WW2 this was a hard decision as cod is not famed for it graphics and I already had a digital copy on PS4 Pro (half price as I game share) on the PRO this game makes my fans sound like the PS4 is about to go into melt down any second! I have had to add cabinet fans to exhaust some of the heat generated by the PRO. The Xbone x version looks better in 4K but both copies are not miles apart graphically and both versions are HDR with the only difference being resolution. That said the Xbone runs cool I mean very cold I have not heard the fans come on once since I've had it. I think on last check I've plaid about 16ish hours of COD and the Xbox and about 10ish on the PS4! (I need a life) The PS4 has crashed once in that time but the amount of times I was kicked out of the servers was crazy( I should add this was the launch weekend of COD and it didn't go great server wise) The online menu's were awful and kept freezing between games. The Xbone hasn't crashed in this time but I have been kicked from a few servers a few times, match making seems better on Xbox live but that might be down to Activision sorting out the server problems and nothing to do with the live service.

    Playing Cod on both systems it has became painfully clear that I favour the dual shock over the Xbox controller any day of the week, I am really struggling to make the jump over to the Xbox's controller and haven't made the adjustment yet.

    Xbox menu's work really well on the x there is no lag when scrolling between tabs like I get on my wife's standard Xbox, everything is sharp, responsive and looks sweet. The Xbox itself is a heavy old beast but is really compact in size and fits nicely next to the PS4.

    Final thoughts...

    If and its a big IF I can get used to the Xbone one's controller then the PS4 might be dead to me from what I have seen so far, the X runs cooler and Xbox live is way faster for downloading Games from the store. I have played a few more cross platform games and they do seem to take a natural boost from the new console and play smoother. Another point to note but not really a negative is the games with the Xbox one x patch can be massive, 100+Gb in some cases so 1TB hard drive isn't going to cut it. (external hard drive on order)

    The PlayStation pro is a good bit of kit but the improvements over the standard PS4 aren't as impressive as the Xbox one x over both the Xbox one s and the PS4 pro, but that extra improvement comes at a cost £450 but on a HDR10 4K TV its worth every penny in my book. looks great, runs cool and Micro$oft seem to have drummed up more game developers to support the x. Time will tell if developers will stick with the x but, so far they seem to have put more effort in the x over the pro.

    remember this is only my opinion so no fan boys get on there high horse and send me crap ... with the exception of prison and shadow who getting shit off will be a given.
     
    • Useful Useful x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    #6 SNIPER___7.62, Nov 13, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2017
  7. Of course myself and Snipes have one.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  8. Just how we roll lol
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  9. I've joined the club...Missus really has outdone herself this year. WOOP WOOP
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page